New Kentucky Derby Points Schedule 2012-2013 vs. 2013 vs. 2014

[peeptoad]

No. Did not see that. Seems like Cairo Prince is getting in since it looks like Dance With Fate will skip the Derby and point to the Preakness since his trainer does not want to run him on three weeks rest.

Where did you read that? What I read was that they didn't want to run him because they wanted to keep him on the AW... at any rate it seems like his participation is up in the air. Derby fever might strike the owners.

[Man o Taz]

I know they mentioned the all weather - but then they also mentioned the Preakness Stakes - so it seemed to me the more important issue was not surface, but rather the quick turna round.

You may be right though - Derby fever could strike the owners in the interim...but they seemed pretty firm - owners, jockey, trainer...that if anything the Preakness was the dirt option and not the Derby.

http://www.nytimes.com/2014/04/13/sports/blue-grass-stakes-winner-isnt-likely-to-run-in-kentucky-derby.html?_r=0

He doesn't have the power to get through dirt," Eurton said. "It will break away from him. I've seen him train over synthetics, and he gets over it so much easier."

Eurton is also concerned about the swift three-week turnaround to the Derby.

Keeneland Race Course in Lexington, Ky., is replacing its synthetic surface with a dirt track despite a record-setting year in 2013.On Horse Racing: A Track's Shift to Dirt Adds to Horses' RisksAPRIL 3, 2014

"I just don't like the idea of coming back that quick. I really don't," he said, indicating that their next target would probably be the Preakness at Baltimore's Pimlico Race Course on May 17.

The winning jockey, Corey Nakatani, held out little hope that he would be allowed a shot at the roses. "I know Pete's style," he said. "He tends to not run them back quick. He truly loves his horses."

http://espn.go.com/horse-racing/story/_/id/10773564/dance-fate-wins-blue-grass-stakes

But trainer Peter Eurton said the Derby, run at 1 ¼ miles on the dirt at Churchill Downs, is an unknown for the Florida-bred son of Two Step Salsa.
"I don't know [if we'll go to the Derby]; it's pretty quick three weeks back and I know he likes synthetic, I just don't know if he likes dirt," said Eurton, who trains for Sharon Alesia, Michael Mellen's Bran Jam Stable, and Joseph Ciaglia's Ciaglia Racing.

"I just don't know," Eurton said of the Derby. "It's three weeks and kind of quick back. I know he loves synthetic better, (likes) turf. I just don't know if he likes dirt. I know I'm going to hear it from everybody, though."

http://www.usatoday.com/story/sports/horseracing/2014/04/12/kentucky-derby-blue-grass-stakes-dance-with-fate/7654909/

He indicated the May 17 Preakness Stakes, the middle leg of the Triple Crown in Baltimore, makes more sense. "It's just more time, smaller field," Eurton said. "... Gosh, 20 horses. You get away bad in there, and you're plastered."

Joe Ciaglia Jr., who owns Dance With Fate with Sharon Alesia and Bran Jam Stable, called the Derby "an option."

"Our idea was not to go there," he said. "We wanted to see how it played out. The horse shows the ability to close and go long. It's something we'll talk about.

"... In this race today with 14 horses, I was very nervous. ... God, you go to 20 horses in the Derby. How am I going to really feel?... Just to go to the Derby just to say I was in the Derby, that's not what we're about. We want to go there and feel like our horse has a chance. We care about our horses, and we want to make sure they're here for a long time."

[Man o Taz]

http://www.drf.com/news/kentucky-derby-2014-point-standings

Rank    Horse    Trainer    Points    Non-Restricted Stakes Earnings
1    California Chrome    Art Sherman    150    $782,250
2    Vicar's in Trouble    Mike Maker    120    $760,000
3    Dance With Fate    Peter Eurton    108    $600,000
4    Wicked Strong    Jimmy Jerkens    102    $640,000
5    Samraat    Rick Violette Jr.    100    $650,000
6    Danza    Todd Pletcher    100    $620,000
7    Constitution    Todd Pletcher    100    $600,000
8    Hoppertunity    Bob Baffert    95    $576,000
9    Intense Holiday    Todd Pletcher    93    $527,500
10    Wildcat Red    Jose Garrofalo    90    $665,500
11    We Miss Artie    Todd Pletcher    60    $544,000
12    Ride on Curlin    Billy Gowan    55    $354,387
13    Chitu    Bob Baffert    54    $440,000
14    Tapiture    Steve Asmussen    52    $470,378
15    Midnight Hawk    Bob Baffert    52    $320,500
16    Ring Weekend    H. Graham Motion    50    $260,000
17    General a Rod    Mike Maker    40    $240,000
18    Medal Count    Dale Romans    40    $226,500
19    Candy Boy    John Sadler    30    $380,000
20    Cairo Prince    Kiaran McLaughlin    24    $520,000
21    Uncle Sigh    Gary Contessa    24    $180,000
22    Vinceremos    Todd Pletcher    20    $191,666
23    Harry's Holiday    Mike Maker    20    $152,622
24    Commanding Curve    Dallas Stewart    20    $140,000
25    Pablo Del Monte    Wesley Ward    20    $102,000
26    Bayern    Bob Baffert    20    $100,000
27    Social Inclusion    Manny Azpurua    20    $100,000
28    Big Bazinga    Katerina Vassilieva    14    $92,149
29    Coastline    Mark Casse    13    $131,346
30    Strong Mandate    D. Wayne Lukas    11    $479,166
31    In Trouble    Tony Dutrow    10    $190,000
32    Noble Moon    Leah Gyarmati    10    $149,000
33    Cleburne    Dale Romans    10    $127,044
34    Commissioner    Todd Pletcher    10    $110,667
35    Schiverelli    Eddie Kenneally    10    $50,000
36    Conquest Titan    Mark Casse    9    $210,945
38    Casiguapo    Mario Morales    5    $272,717
39    Asserting Bear    Reade Baker    5    $33,099

[Man o Taz]

http://www.drf.com/news/kentucky-derby-2014-point-standings

Rank    Horse    Trainer    Points    Non-Restricted Stakes Earnings
1    California Chrome    Art Sherman    150    $782,250
2    Vicar's in Trouble    Mike Maker    120    $760,000
3    Dance With Fate    Peter Eurton    108    $600,000
4    Wicked Strong    Jimmy Jerkens    102    $640,000
5    Samraat    Rick Violette Jr.    100    $650,000
6    Danza    Todd Pletcher    100    $620,000
7    Constitution    Todd Pletcher    100    $600,000
8    Hoppertunity    Bob Baffert    95    $576,000
9    Intense Holiday    Todd Pletcher    93    $527,500
10    Wildcat Red    Jose Garrofalo    90    $665,500
11    We Miss Artie    Todd Pletcher    60    $544,000
12    Ride on Curlin    Billy Gowan    55    $354,387
13    Chitu    Bob Baffert    54    $440,000?
14    Tapiture    Steve Asmussen    52    $470,378
15    Midnight Hawk    Bob Baffert    52    $320,500
16    Ring Weekend    H. Graham Motion    50    $260,000
17    General a Rod    Mike Maker    40    $240,000
18    Medal Count    Dale Romans    40    $226,500
19    Candy Boy    John Sadler    30    $380,000
20    Cairo Prince    Kiaran McLaughlin    24    $520,000
21    Uncle Sigh    Gary Contessa    24    $180,000
22    Vinceremos    Todd Pletcher    20    $191,666
23    Harry's Holiday    Mike Maker    20    $152,622
24    Commanding Curve    Dallas Stewart    20    $140,000
25    Pablo Del Monte    Wesley Ward    20    $102,000
26    Bayern    Bob Baffert    20    $100,000
27    Social Inclusion    Manny Azpurua    20    $100,000
28    Big Bazinga    Katerina Vassilieva    14    $92,149
29    Coastline    Mark Casse    13    $131,346
30    Strong Mandate    D. Wayne Lukas    11    $479,166
31    In Trouble    Tony Dutrow    10    $190,000
32    Noble Moon    Leah Gyarmati    10    $149,000
33    Cleburne    Dale Romans    10    $127,044
34    Commissioner    Todd Pletcher    10    $110,667
35    Schiverelli    Eddie Kenneally    10    $50,000
36    Conquest Titan    Mark Casse    9    $210,945
38    Casiguapo    Mario Morales    5    $272,717
39    Asserting Bear    Reade Baker    5    $33,099

No need to update since Mr. Speaker's 10 points will not factor into who gets in the starting gate in two weeks.

Just for fun I checked to see how many of the top 20 I have had the chance to see in person the last two years...10 of them...

And if Social Inclusion makes it...11. 

[Man o Taz]

Its curious Tamarando is not listed on current Kentucky Derby point totals since he is still in training.

He has 12 points...not enough to get him in the Derby - and it looks like not providing points for the Cash Call Futurity will not penalize any horses...since he would have only had 14...if the Cash Call's third place finish awarded him points.

However, it does look, with the defections, that 10 points may have been enough to get him in the gate since he would have held the tiebreaker with the most graded stakes earnings of any other horse with 22 points...

[Man o Taz]

Well, with Bayern's running in the Derby Trial it looks like a 14 point horse may get in the gate after all...since Pablo Del Monte is the last 20 point horse and he is sitting at 21.

I don't know if Big Bazinga made the trip to Churchill Downs - but he might be able to make it in...

I think 20 points is still too low a total for a horse to make the gate at Churchill Downs. I think it should be a minimum of 25 points or you don't get in.

That would mean Candy Boy would be the last horse to get into the gate with 30.

Entering the gate at Churchill Downs should not just be something that you earn - but it should also be something that you deserve...and being able to accumulate 10 points last year, and 20 points this year when you have other horses entering the gate with 7 times that to me is a shame.

I also think you should have to finish in the money in a minimum of two graded stakes as well - it could be as a two year old or a three year old - but you should have to demonstrate a level of consistency as a top horse to make the gate.

Now, some want to suggest that the 2009 Kentucky Derby had one of the weakest fields - and suggest that Mine That Bird was undeserving to even be in the gate, but he has been the champion two year old in Canada and that by itself should entitle him to enter the gate given his earnings, etc.

I know this would exclude a horse like Danza that managed to have one big hit...from making the gate....but I believe the top three year old race should be for the top horses.   

http://www.drf.com/news/kentucky-derby-2014-point-standings

Rank    Horse    Trainer    Points    Non-Restricted Stakes Earnings
1    California Chrome    Art Sherman    150    $782,250
2    Vicar's in Trouble    Mike Maker    120    $760,000
3    Dance With Fate    Peter Eurton    108    $600,000
4    Wicked Strong    Jimmy Jerkens    102    $630,000
5    Samraat    Rick Violette Jr.    100    $640,000
6    Danza    Todd Pletcher    100    $620,000
7    Hoppertunity    Bob Baffert    95    $576,000
8    Intense Holiday    Todd Pletcher    93    $527,500
9    Wildcat Red    Jose Garrofalo    90    $610,000
10    We Miss Artie    Todd Pletcher    60    $544,000
11    Ride on Curlin    Billy Gowan    55    $354,387
12    Chitu    Bob Baffert    54    $440,000
13    Tapiture    Steve Asmussen    52    $470,378
14    General a Rod    Mike Maker    40    $240,000
15    Medal Count    Dale Romans    40    $226,500
16    Candy Boy    John Sadler    30    $380,000
17    Uncle Sigh    Gary Contessa    24    $180,000
18    Vinceremos    Todd Pletcher    20    $191,666
19    Harry's Holiday    Mike Maker    20    $152,622
20    Commanding Curve    Dallas Stewart    20    $140,000
21    Pablo Del Monte    Wesley Ward    20    $102,000
22    Big Bazinga    Katerina Vassilieva    14    $92,149
23    Coastline    Mark Casse    13    $131,346
24    Strong Mandate    D. Wayne Lukas    11    $479,166
25    In Trouble    Tony Dutrow    10    $190,000
26    Noble Moon    Leah Gyarmati    10    $170,000
27    Cleburne    Dale Romans    10    $127,044
28    Commissioner    Todd Pletcher    10    $110,667
29    Schiverelli    Eddie Kenneally    10    $40,000
30    Conquest Titan    Mark Casse    9    $210,945
31    Casiguapo    Mario Morales    5    $272,717
32    Asserting Bear    Reade Baker    5    $33,099